I can definitely understand how this may seem as an inconsistency on Ada’s part. I’ve been critical of Ada in the past, but I see this as more of Ada taking a calculated, diplomatic approach.
With the Feddit situation, Feddit is just another random Lemmy instance, so there’s no real loss in defederating. But ML is where Lemmy development is centered, and whether Blahaj users like it or not, they do have an intrinsic interest in the development of Lemmy’s code. They want Blahaj to be a safe space, which requires moderation tools to be developed, and it’s helpful to keep an open connection with the developers in that case so that Blahaj’s input and contributions can be considered when these tools are built.
At least, that’s just my speculation as to why there’s an inconsistency.
I think it would be better for Lemmy’s development if everyone defederated lemmy.ml. If Dessalines weren’t so busy banning users on other instances for pointing out the Uyghur genocide, he’d have a lot more time to write code.
lemmy. ml currently has a significant number of users and, as far as I can tell the main complaint about it is relating to communist economic beliefs and authoritarian political beliefs.
the devs of lemmy are already working on it full time. they’re not the ones who do most of the moderation work.
the thing i’ve always hated about most people outside ml is that they always make assumptions, not even wondering if what they’re saying might be false. if you’re gonna be prissy about something, at least get your facts straight.
edit: sorry about the last paragraph. i just supposed that you were making stuff up because i couldn’t find the modlog, but didn’t know any better.
Dessalines does a ton of the moderation on .ml. He and davel are, as far as I can tell, the main moderators for the whole server and all its communities.
I’m not subscribed to most of their stuff, so it’s hard to check for hard numbers or verify that, but I see him all the time on the “let’s complain about Lemmy.ml moderation” subs. Doing a quick spot-check in the modlog for !fediverse@lemmy.ml, which I am subscribed to, I see:
46% of moderation actions were by davel
39% by dessalines
12% by Arthur Besse
2% by nutomic
0% by the moderators of the community
That’s extremely consistent with what I have observed from the rest of the communities on the server.
not even wondering if what they’re saying might be false
I wonder how many times I personally have over most servers
been misgendered, intentionally or not
seen the b word
seen the c word
And complained about it for myself?
Guess where I haven’t seen it happen very often.
Eta: I looked through modlog here last night and saw a LOT of unexplained actions that were obscure and twice as many that were self explanatory. All I can say is, be glad you weren’t kids in late 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s. I’m not sure how many would have made it through now. That’s isn’t * a dig either, I’m noting the difference. And managing emotions needs to be a thing because what were facing globally is going to take us backwards, socially.
the lemmy.ml modlog is obfuscated. it only says “mod” when you look at who did the moding. plus, the last time the lead devs were appointed as mods was at least 3 years ago, for both dessalines and nutomic, during the reddit exodus.
unless there is information i somehow missed, you’re just proving my point
The lemmy.ml modlog is not obfuscated for admins on other servers.
You ignored my message where I talked about this, and checked and did the math to verify the assertion, and instead you wrote this comment, continuing to pretend that the facts were unknowable and saying “unless there is information I somehow missed.”
the thing i’ve always hated about most people outside ml is that they always make assumptions, not even wondering if what they’re saying might be false
if you’re gonna be prissy about something, at least get your facts straight.
I didn’t ignore your message. I saw it while getting to class, and didn’t want to get late just because I’m arguing online. I’ll just put what I think about what you said in here at the same time since I’m on break anyways.
I’m not pretending, I genuinly can’t find it. I remember it being accessible at some point, but only for other instances, not ml. I go to the modlog and only see “mod” as well, not a specific user. Shit on me for not knowing how to use lemmy well, sure, but stop acting as if everything I say is disengenuous. This is what I was saying I was frustrated by on lemmy: acting as if everything an ml user does is donne for some nefarious reason.
I don’t think percentages are a good representation of mod activity. Something like mod actions per day would be better. I was also basing my statement on the fact that modding is a volunteer job and is usually done alongside your actual job, and that dessalines affirms that he works on lemmy in full time. I think the other devs would also be upset if he just freeloaded off of them just to spend his time modding. Unless you think anyone would have a reason to let that slide?
I’m not saying anything at all about .ml users in general. I’m not even sure where you got that. I’m saying that you seem to be failing to understand the simple explanation I’m giving you for why you don’t see names in the modlog, but other people do. I’m also saying some specific things about dessalines. Nothing about lemmy.ml in general is the reason for anything I am saying in this exchange.
Maybe it was unfair for me to accuse you of “pretending” not to see my message. I guess maybe it is genuinely an issue of reading comprehension / attention level, and not of anything “pretending.” I do think it’s fair to point out when I explain to you why you don’t see names in the modlog, and you simply move on with the conversation as if that exchange hadn’t happened, and you still don’t understand why you don’t see names in the modlog or how anyone else would be able to therefore. That’s weird. Why do you do that? I guess… thinking that correct answers only come from you? No point in reading other people’s messages to find correct answers in them, because you already know, and you can just skim the message quick and then get back to accusing people of weird things they didn’t say?
Go back and read the message instead of searching again in the Lemmy UI. I explained the issue to you. It’s literally the first sentence, all on a line on its own, it’s not like buried deep in some kind of abstract discussion where I am going into minutiae or anything. I’m not trying to get in an argument or asking you to. There’s nothing to argue about. What I explained is how Lemmy works. Read, understand. Or choose not to, up to you.
IDK what you’re on about that percentages are not a good representation. If you take the busy-ness level of a main active instance, and say that one person is doing almost half the moderation, that’s a significant moderation load (even if they were not being additionally extra in what level of comment they feel like needs moderation). In my opinion.
Anyway, in the last 3 days, I see on my instance 12 moderation actions by dessalines (more than half the ones I can even see on lemmy.ml as a whole). I am subscribed to barely anything on lemmy.ml, so I don’t know what factor you want to multiply that by to arrive at how much he is doing that doesn’t get federated to me or how big a part of his day it is. And of course he’s free to do whatever he wants with his time. But, regardless, just going by what I can see and what gets federated to me, it looks like he spends a not insignificant amount of time moderating lemmy.ml personally.
Wait. You write all that to this user about reading comprehension when they explained that’s what it looked like to them, then say
But, regardless, just going by what I can see and what gets federated to me, it looks like he spends a not insignificant amount of time moderating lemmy.ml personally.
You know what I see in this thread? A lot of pots and kettles, and supposedly grown children.
Sorry I meant to say I can’t see them despite being subscribed. I’m subscribed to a bunch of ml communities for a really long time, but the modlog is just filled with “mod” for these communities no matter how far I scroll. for example:
Or do you mean subscribing to the modlogs themselves? I’m not sure any of my clients support that.
I can definitely understand how this may seem as an inconsistency on Ada’s part. I’ve been critical of Ada in the past, but I see this as more of Ada taking a calculated, diplomatic approach.
With the Feddit situation, Feddit is just another random Lemmy instance, so there’s no real loss in defederating. But ML is where Lemmy development is centered, and whether Blahaj users like it or not, they do have an intrinsic interest in the development of Lemmy’s code. They want Blahaj to be a safe space, which requires moderation tools to be developed, and it’s helpful to keep an open connection with the developers in that case so that Blahaj’s input and contributions can be considered when these tools are built.
At least, that’s just my speculation as to why there’s an inconsistency.
I think it would be better for Lemmy’s development if everyone defederated lemmy.ml. If Dessalines weren’t so busy banning users on other instances for pointing out the Uyghur genocide, he’d have a lot more time to write code.
lemmy. ml currently has a significant number of users and, as far as I can tell the main complaint about it is relating to communist economic beliefs and authoritarian political beliefs.
the devs of lemmy are already working on it full time. they’re not the ones who do most of the moderation work.
the thing i’ve always hated about most people outside ml is that they always make assumptions, not even wondering if what they’re saying might be false. if you’re gonna be prissy about something, at least get your facts straight.
edit: sorry about the last paragraph. i just supposed that you were making stuff up because i couldn’t find the modlog, but didn’t know any better.
Dessalines does a ton of the moderation on .ml. He and davel are, as far as I can tell, the main moderators for the whole server and all its communities.
I’m not subscribed to most of their stuff, so it’s hard to check for hard numbers or verify that, but I see him all the time on the “let’s complain about Lemmy.ml moderation” subs. Doing a quick spot-check in the modlog for !fediverse@lemmy.ml, which I am subscribed to, I see:
That’s extremely consistent with what I have observed from the rest of the communities on the server.
Why do I hear Alanis Morissette in the distance?
I wonder how many times I personally have over most servers
been misgendered, intentionally or not
seen the b word
seen the c word
And complained about it for myself?
Guess where I haven’t seen it happen very often.
Eta: I looked through modlog here last night and saw a LOT of unexplained actions that were obscure and twice as many that were self explanatory. All I can say is, be glad you weren’t kids in late 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s. I’m not sure how many would have made it through now. That’s isn’t * a dig either, I’m noting the difference. And managing emotions needs to be a thing because what were facing globally is going to take us backwards, socially.
Funny, why is it so common to see the lead dev in the modlog, then?
the lemmy.ml modlog is obfuscated. it only says “mod” when you look at who did the moding. plus, the last time the lead devs were appointed as mods was at least 3 years ago, for both dessalines and nutomic, during the reddit exodus.
unless there is information i somehow missed, you’re just proving my point
The lemmy.ml modlog is not obfuscated for admins on other servers.
You ignored my message where I talked about this, and checked and did the math to verify the assertion, and instead you wrote this comment, continuing to pretend that the facts were unknowable and saying “unless there is information I somehow missed.”
I didn’t ignore your message. I saw it while getting to class, and didn’t want to get late just because I’m arguing online. I’ll just put what I think about what you said in here at the same time since I’m on break anyways.
I’m not pretending, I genuinly can’t find it. I remember it being accessible at some point, but only for other instances, not ml. I go to the modlog and only see “mod” as well, not a specific user. Shit on me for not knowing how to use lemmy well, sure, but stop acting as if everything I say is disengenuous. This is what I was saying I was frustrated by on lemmy: acting as if everything an ml user does is donne for some nefarious reason.
I don’t think percentages are a good representation of mod activity. Something like mod actions per day would be better. I was also basing my statement on the fact that modding is a volunteer job and is usually done alongside your actual job, and that dessalines affirms that he works on lemmy in full time. I think the other devs would also be upset if he just freeloaded off of them just to spend his time modding. Unless you think anyone would have a reason to let that slide?
I’m not saying anything at all about .ml users in general. I’m not even sure where you got that. I’m saying that you seem to be failing to understand the simple explanation I’m giving you for why you don’t see names in the modlog, but other people do. I’m also saying some specific things about dessalines. Nothing about lemmy.ml in general is the reason for anything I am saying in this exchange.
Maybe it was unfair for me to accuse you of “pretending” not to see my message. I guess maybe it is genuinely an issue of reading comprehension / attention level, and not of anything “pretending.” I do think it’s fair to point out when I explain to you why you don’t see names in the modlog, and you simply move on with the conversation as if that exchange hadn’t happened, and you still don’t understand why you don’t see names in the modlog or how anyone else would be able to therefore. That’s weird. Why do you do that? I guess… thinking that correct answers only come from you? No point in reading other people’s messages to find correct answers in them, because you already know, and you can just skim the message quick and then get back to accusing people of weird things they didn’t say?
Go back and read the message instead of searching again in the Lemmy UI. I explained the issue to you. It’s literally the first sentence, all on a line on its own, it’s not like buried deep in some kind of abstract discussion where I am going into minutiae or anything. I’m not trying to get in an argument or asking you to. There’s nothing to argue about. What I explained is how Lemmy works. Read, understand. Or choose not to, up to you.
IDK what you’re on about that percentages are not a good representation. If you take the busy-ness level of a main active instance, and say that one person is doing almost half the moderation, that’s a significant moderation load (even if they were not being additionally extra in what level of comment they feel like needs moderation). In my opinion.
Anyway, in the last 3 days, I see on my instance 12 moderation actions by dessalines (more than half the ones I can even see on lemmy.ml as a whole). I am subscribed to barely anything on lemmy.ml, so I don’t know what factor you want to multiply that by to arrive at how much he is doing that doesn’t get federated to me or how big a part of his day it is. And of course he’s free to do whatever he wants with his time. But, regardless, just going by what I can see and what gets federated to me, it looks like he spends a not insignificant amount of time moderating lemmy.ml personally.
Wait. You write all that to this user about reading comprehension when they explained that’s what it looked like to them, then say
You know what I see in this thread? A lot of pots and kettles, and supposedly grown children.
I
Sorry I meant to say I can’t see them despite being subscribed. I’m subscribed to a bunch of ml communities for a really long time, but the modlog is just filled with “mod” for these communities no matter how far I scroll. for example:
Or do you mean subscribing to the modlogs themselves? I’m not sure any of my clients support that.
Ha.