“Pre-emptive” and “self-defense” are objectively true here. Hezbollah initiated its current conflict with Israel and continues to launch attacks; Israel is fighting defensively and destruction of Hezbollah assets prevents future attacks on Israel.
(You might believe that Hezbollah is justified in attacking Israel, but it’s still the attacker and Israel is still the defender.)
“Pre-emptive” and “self-defense” are objectively true here.
Is it opposite day already? Better get my festive sash!
Hezbollah initiated its current conflict with Israel
According to the IDF and American intelligence who came to the conclusion within an hour arter the attack, have shown no proof to support the claim and both have a history of false conclusions and outright fabrications when it suits their pro-Israel narrative.
Israel is fighting defensively
Nope. There’s no defensive way to bomb civilian targets. That’s not how the word or indeed the world works.
destruction of Hezbollah assets prevents future attacks on Israel.
On the contrary: Hezbollah is a terrorist group.
Just like with Hamas in Gaza, every Lebanese civilian murdered by the IDF makes Hezbollah more influential and thus more powerful as the number of people radicalized by the murder of their loved ones rises.
You can’t bomb a terrorist organization out of existence any more than you can make your neighbors like you by killing their parents.
You might believe that Hezbollah is justified in attacking Israel
Nope. Not at all.
Israel is still the defender
Also no, though. Their actions and their unconditional US support is the number one cause of political instability and violence in the Middle East.
According to the IDF and American intelligence who came to the conclusion within an hour arter the attack, have shown no proof to support the claim and both have a history of false conclusions and outright fabrications when it suits their pro-Israel narrative.
Uh no, according to Hezbollah themselves. Unless of course you believe the Hezbollah leadership are all Mossad plants
Nope. There’s no defensive way to bomb civilian targets. That’s not how the word or indeed the world works.
There were 3 deaths on the Lebanese side: 2 Hezbollah fighters and 1 from an associated
Hezbollah deputy chief Naim Qassem said on Friday that the group would not be swayed by calls for it to stay on the sidelines of the ongoing conflict between Israel and Hamas, saying the party was “fully ready” to contribute to the fighting.
Hezbollah said the strikes killed two of its fighters in al-Tiri. The Hezbollah-allied Shi’ite Muslim group Amal said a strike on Khiam killed one of its fighters.
How on earth can you take “we’re prepared” to mean claiming that they DID the thing? 🤦
As for the other one, it’s very vague. There’s no indication of whether or not there’s uncounted civilians, only casualties of the official participants with their source being the notorious massacrer of innocents and burier of truth IDF…
I think you have a very, very onesided view on this
You can find plenty of articles from October where Hezbollah is proud to declare they were attacking Israel to support Gaza and tie up some of Israel’s forces
You can find plenty of articles about how almost all civilians in Southern Lebanon have been evacuated.
There’s no indication of whether or not there’s uncounted civilians, only casualties of the official participants with their source being the notorious massacrer of innocents and burier of truth IDF…
The information you’re disputing is not coming from the IDF but directly from Hezbollah themselves, on both these issues
I share your opinion. I don’t think its worth continuing to debate that guy as you’ll never come to a conclusion. It doesn’t really matter what one thinks of the civilian tragedy in Gaza when it comes to whether or not Israel is fighting Hezbollah defensively. In support of Hamas they started sending more bombs in the northern border of Israel so the IDF followed suite to prevent Hezbollah.
I think you have a very, very onesided view on this
Yeah, I do. Because some things aren’t about sides but about whether or not something is factually accurate.
I’m on the “side” of not doing free PR for known liars whether they be Israel claiming they never did anything wrong, or terrorists bragging without evidence.
almost all civilians in Southern Lebanon have been evacuated.
Guess what? Forced relocation is in itself a war crime. Forcing people out of their homes so that needlessly bombing them to rubble won’t look as bad as it otherwise would is NOT a kindness.
The information you’re disputing is not coming from the IDF but directly from Hezbollah themselves, on both these issues
So you keep claiming without any source except “trust me, dude” 🙄
So you keep claiming without any source except “trust me, dude” 🙄
It’s quite interesting, you asked for sources so I gave you some a couple posts up, but your reaction just comes down to “well yeah everyone is always lying so why would I believe that?”
You cannot “pre-emptively” defend yourself, an attack to head off a suspected attack is still an attack.
Other than that semantic nitpick, personally I’m there with you… However, you cannot seriously be pointing this out without also recognizing that Israel is very much the initial offender in any conflict that arises as direct result of their actions in gaza.
If I let a bully sucker punch me so I have an excuse to beat up all the people around them, and then someone else close by hits me, I can’t honestly say I am the one who is defending myself.
I think the purpose of the word “pre-emptive” is to describe a situation where one side appears to attack first but that side is actually acting to prevent an attack against itself. Consider a less controversial situation: Ukraine launched drones into Russia in order to blow up glide bombs in storage at Russian airbases. I suppose that could be described as a “pre-emptive attack” but I still see it as an act of self-defense.
With regard to your second point: Hezbollah has agency. They weren’t just helplessly carried along by events in Gaza; they chose to get involved. Their choice was predictable, but it was still theirs. One could argue that it was justified (and Hezbollah would certainly argue that it was justified) but justification is a matter of opinion and even if an attack is considered justified, the defender is still, well, defending.
“Pre-emptive” and “self-defense” are objectively true here. Hezbollah initiated its current conflict with Israel and continues to launch attacks; Israel is fighting defensively and destruction of Hezbollah assets prevents future attacks on Israel.
(You might believe that Hezbollah is justified in attacking Israel, but it’s still the attacker and Israel is still the defender.)
Is it opposite day already? Better get my festive sash!
According to the IDF and American intelligence who came to the conclusion within an hour arter the attack, have shown no proof to support the claim and both have a history of false conclusions and outright fabrications when it suits their pro-Israel narrative.
Nope. There’s no defensive way to bomb civilian targets. That’s not how the word or indeed the world works.
On the contrary: Hezbollah is a terrorist group.
Just like with Hamas in Gaza, every Lebanese civilian murdered by the IDF makes Hezbollah more influential and thus more powerful as the number of people radicalized by the murder of their loved ones rises.
You can’t bomb a terrorist organization out of existence any more than you can make your neighbors like you by killing their parents.
Nope. Not at all.
Also no, though. Their actions and their unconditional US support is the number one cause of political instability and violence in the Middle East.
Uh no, according to Hezbollah themselves. Unless of course you believe the Hezbollah leadership are all Mossad plants
There were 3 deaths on the Lebanese side: 2 Hezbollah fighters and 1 from an associated
Gonna need a source on that.
Sounds EXTREMELY unlike how the IDF tends to operate. Gonna need a reliable source on that one too.
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/hezbollah-says-when-time-comes-any-action-we-will-carry-it-out-2023-10-13/
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israel-strikes-hezbollah-targets-lebanon-military-says-2024-08-25/
How on earth can you take “we’re prepared” to mean claiming that they DID the thing? 🤦
As for the other one, it’s very vague. There’s no indication of whether or not there’s uncounted civilians, only casualties of the official participants with their source being the notorious massacrer of innocents and burier of truth IDF…
I think you have a very, very onesided view on this
You can find plenty of articles from October where Hezbollah is proud to declare they were attacking Israel to support Gaza and tie up some of Israel’s forces
You can find plenty of articles about how almost all civilians in Southern Lebanon have been evacuated.
The information you’re disputing is not coming from the IDF but directly from Hezbollah themselves, on both these issues
I share your opinion. I don’t think its worth continuing to debate that guy as you’ll never come to a conclusion. It doesn’t really matter what one thinks of the civilian tragedy in Gaza when it comes to whether or not Israel is fighting Hezbollah defensively. In support of Hamas they started sending more bombs in the northern border of Israel so the IDF followed suite to prevent Hezbollah.
Yeah, I do. Because some things aren’t about sides but about whether or not something is factually accurate.
I’m on the “side” of not doing free PR for known liars whether they be Israel claiming they never did anything wrong, or terrorists bragging without evidence.
Guess what? Forced relocation is in itself a war crime. Forcing people out of their homes so that needlessly bombing them to rubble won’t look as bad as it otherwise would is NOT a kindness.
So you keep claiming without any source except “trust me, dude” 🙄
It’s quite interesting, you asked for sources so I gave you some a couple posts up, but your reaction just comes down to “well yeah everyone is always lying so why would I believe that?”
This is some George W Bush doublespeak.
You cannot “pre-emptively” defend yourself, an attack to head off a suspected attack is still an attack.
Other than that semantic nitpick, personally I’m there with you… However, you cannot seriously be pointing this out without also recognizing that Israel is very much the initial offender in any conflict that arises as direct result of their actions in gaza.
If I let a bully sucker punch me so I have an excuse to beat up all the people around them, and then someone else close by hits me, I can’t honestly say I am the one who is defending myself.
Removed by mod
I think the purpose of the word “pre-emptive” is to describe a situation where one side appears to attack first but that side is actually acting to prevent an attack against itself. Consider a less controversial situation: Ukraine launched drones into Russia in order to blow up glide bombs in storage at Russian airbases. I suppose that could be described as a “pre-emptive attack” but I still see it as an act of self-defense.
With regard to your second point: Hezbollah has agency. They weren’t just helplessly carried along by events in Gaza; they chose to get involved. Their choice was predictable, but it was still theirs. One could argue that it was justified (and Hezbollah would certainly argue that it was justified) but justification is a matter of opinion and even if an attack is considered justified, the defender is still, well, defending.
Israel attacked Lebanon first not the other way around.
Removed by mod
Right? They’ve been cruisin’ for a bruisin’ for a long time. I really don’t care what happens to them.