I just don’t see the point. What is “consequential” about shutting down a road? What are you trying to achieve exactly? Are you doing it just because it’s beneficial in and of itself? Shutting down one road out of the millions on Earth for like an hour does practically nothing and you should spend your time more wisely. Are you trying to win hearts and minds? People will do far more than just ignore your cause, they will actively despise it. Or is it just out of spite for commuters? Even though many of them, as you said, have limited means to change anything. Not everyone can afford to just quit their job to get one closer.
It would also kind of go against their own point if public transit was also stopped. Sometimes you can’t just live near absolutely everything. Some people have disabilities and cannot physically ride a bike to get where they need to go. That would maybe also encourage people to take a car or a carpool, where they’re more likely to be able to do a u turn.
They are bringing awareness to the cause. Yes they are annoying the fuck of “innocent bystanders” but if they went on to a street and handed out flyers they would do fuck all, because people would just ignore them.
Plus this is not a “us” vs “them”. It’s not like they want to save “their” planet. There’s only one earth last I checked. So people might be angry about it, many will just laugh and say it’s stupid, others will join the cause and/or demand change.
People think they are so smart to ridicule them for throwing food at some paintings but they just want to feel better about themselves about not doing anything. So they criticize them to hide that discomfort. “If what they are doing is stupid, then I won’t feel bad for not doing it.”
I ask you? What do you suggest they do instead? And then go a check because for sure they did it and either it didn’t do shit or they are still doing it.
There are countless of ways to to that. I could bring awareness by killing puppies, burning down orphanages, or any number of comically heinous things. The more outlandish the better. So why stop at blocking traffic? Just do the most hateful, awful thing imaginable because “bringing awareness to the cause” is all that matters right? Obviously you have to draw the line somewhere. Not all forms of protest are just automagically valid and effective just from virtue of being protests.
Great examples. Because blocking roads and mildly inconveniencing people that can demand change is almost the same as killing animals and children. Yes the line has to be drawn somewhere, and it’s between those two things and very close to one of them.
But again, what way that hasn’t been tried would be ok in your book? Asking people nicely?
Why the snark? I literally used the term “comically heinous” myself to describe the examples. I am aware they are extreme, it was to demonstrate my point…
So we disagree on where that line should be drawn. And it comes down to the fact that you think blocking traffic is “mildly inconveniencing”. I would say: how the fuck do you know? You don’t know what’s going on in the lives of those people.
Maybe someone got a call from the hospital that their father is dying and they should come in to see them one last time.
Maybe a food insecure parent is working hard to support their children and if they are late one more time they could get axed and put their children in danger.
Maybe someone chopped their finger off and are rushing to the hospital to get it reattached.
Or any number of scenarios. If YOU were in any of these situations, what would you think of the people blocking the road? Somehow I don’t think you would be so understanding when it happens to you personally.
But again, what way that hasn’t been tried would be ok in your book? Asking people nicely?
I think my position is clear. I’m OK with any form of protest that actually advances the cause behind the protest and I am not OK with any form of protest that is counter-productive against the cause of the protest. I started out my comments by saying what standing in a road accomplishes, and so far all you’ve really said is “uh, well nothing else has worked so why not?”. That really isn’t good enough.
And exactly what kind of protest is that?
Again you still haven’t answered my question and more and more it seems that there is no such protest so we will all live miserable lives in the future but hey, at least people weren’t bothered those few times.
Also you can block roads and let emergency vehicles through. Accidents happen, roads get blocked for a variety of reasons on a daily basis. If people used cars less they would be less congestioned, do you also use that argument there?
Finally, people do die of climate change. Everyday and it’s not a small amount. Consider that on the other side of the equation whenever you make one.
Either way I’m calling this convo. Have a nice day and weekend. Hope it’s not too hot wherever you are.
Because the people you are “inconveniencing” don’t make the decisions. They are mostly people just doing what they have to to survive. Find a way to inconvenience the decision-makers, and it will have everyone’s support.
lol I posted first! You responded to me. I was the one posing the question: What is the benefit of blocking the road? Any discussion outside of that scope is moving the goalpost and I won’t entertain it. So far I’ve seen you propose a grand total of zero benefits so I’m just going to assume there are none.
I just don’t see the point. What is “consequential” about shutting down a road? What are you trying to achieve exactly? Are you doing it just because it’s beneficial in and of itself? Shutting down one road out of the millions on Earth for like an hour does practically nothing and you should spend your time more wisely. Are you trying to win hearts and minds? People will do far more than just ignore your cause, they will actively despise it. Or is it just out of spite for commuters? Even though many of them, as you said, have limited means to change anything. Not everyone can afford to just quit their job to get one closer.
It would also kind of go against their own point if public transit was also stopped. Sometimes you can’t just live near absolutely everything. Some people have disabilities and cannot physically ride a bike to get where they need to go. That would maybe also encourage people to take a car or a carpool, where they’re more likely to be able to do a u turn.
They are bringing awareness to the cause. Yes they are annoying the fuck of “innocent bystanders” but if they went on to a street and handed out flyers they would do fuck all, because people would just ignore them.
Plus this is not a “us” vs “them”. It’s not like they want to save “their” planet. There’s only one earth last I checked. So people might be angry about it, many will just laugh and say it’s stupid, others will join the cause and/or demand change.
People think they are so smart to ridicule them for throwing food at some paintings but they just want to feel better about themselves about not doing anything. So they criticize them to hide that discomfort. “If what they are doing is stupid, then I won’t feel bad for not doing it.”
I ask you? What do you suggest they do instead? And then go a check because for sure they did it and either it didn’t do shit or they are still doing it.
There are countless of ways to to that. I could bring awareness by killing puppies, burning down orphanages, or any number of comically heinous things. The more outlandish the better. So why stop at blocking traffic? Just do the most hateful, awful thing imaginable because “bringing awareness to the cause” is all that matters right? Obviously you have to draw the line somewhere. Not all forms of protest are just automagically valid and effective just from virtue of being protests.
Great examples. Because blocking roads and mildly inconveniencing people that can demand change is almost the same as killing animals and children. Yes the line has to be drawn somewhere, and it’s between those two things and very close to one of them.
But again, what way that hasn’t been tried would be ok in your book? Asking people nicely?
Read the top comment in this post again.
Blocking roads can literally kill people, by stopping emergency vehicles etc from getting to where they need to go
So does climate change…
Also car accidents block roads as well. Should we forbid people from using their cars?
So does burning orphanages, so apparently they are kind of equal then with your logic?
Plus, orphanages can catch fire from issues with electrical wiring, therefore we should forbid orphanages from using electricity, right?
Why the snark? I literally used the term “comically heinous” myself to describe the examples. I am aware they are extreme, it was to demonstrate my point…
So we disagree on where that line should be drawn. And it comes down to the fact that you think blocking traffic is “mildly inconveniencing”. I would say: how the fuck do you know? You don’t know what’s going on in the lives of those people.
Or any number of scenarios. If YOU were in any of these situations, what would you think of the people blocking the road? Somehow I don’t think you would be so understanding when it happens to you personally.
I think my position is clear. I’m OK with any form of protest that actually advances the cause behind the protest and I am not OK with any form of protest that is counter-productive against the cause of the protest. I started out my comments by saying what standing in a road accomplishes, and so far all you’ve really said is “uh, well nothing else has worked so why not?”. That really isn’t good enough.
And exactly what kind of protest is that? Again you still haven’t answered my question and more and more it seems that there is no such protest so we will all live miserable lives in the future but hey, at least people weren’t bothered those few times.
Also you can block roads and let emergency vehicles through. Accidents happen, roads get blocked for a variety of reasons on a daily basis. If people used cars less they would be less congestioned, do you also use that argument there?
Finally, people do die of climate change. Everyday and it’s not a small amount. Consider that on the other side of the equation whenever you make one.
Either way I’m calling this convo. Have a nice day and weekend. Hope it’s not too hot wherever you are.
Because the people you are “inconveniencing” don’t make the decisions. They are mostly people just doing what they have to to survive. Find a way to inconvenience the decision-makers, and it will have everyone’s support.
They vote. That’s not nothing and better than hoping that the people destroying the planet will suddenly become good people and stop doing that.
But again, all this complaining and no one is suggesting alternatives… very telling.
You say that in response to a comment wherein I suggest an alternative. Very telling.
lol I posted first! You responded to me. I was the one posing the question: What is the benefit of blocking the road? Any discussion outside of that scope is moving the goalpost and I won’t entertain it. So far I’ve seen you propose a grand total of zero benefits so I’m just going to assume there are none.
My first comment literally responds to the purpose/benefit of blocking a road. But for that you’d need to know how to read.
But I agree, let’s end it here