• Pennomi@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      17
      ·
      7 months ago

      When entire civilian populations are bombed or starved, then yes. The US is not free of war crimes. They’re merely immune from the consequences.

      • FlowVoid@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        6
        arrow-down
        8
        ·
        7 months ago

        Not just the US. Chechnya was invaded by Russia. German civilians were bombed by the UK and USSR.

        In fact, it’s hard to find a large-scale modern war that didn’t cause thousands of civilian casualties.

        • Pennomi@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          7
          ·
          7 months ago

          Absolutely, there were millions of civilian casualties in WWII. The difference here is that there have been, according to Israel, only 273 soldiers killed in ground operation combat vs the 13,000 civilians killed on Gaza’s side. (According to the new, lower estimates.) This is not so much a war as a one-sided beatdown.

          • DarkGamer@kbin.social
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            2
            arrow-down
            3
            ·
            7 months ago

            Are you really suggesting that every asymmetrical war that is conducted successfully is genocide? O.o

            • Pennomi@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              6
              ·
              7 months ago

              No, I’m saying that if a nation has such a huge advantage they also have more responsibility to select targets carefully so as to not kill noncombatants.

              • FlowVoid@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                2
                arrow-down
                3
                ·
                edit-2
                7 months ago

                A nation taking lots of casualties has the same responsibilities as one taking few casualties.

                That said, the proportion of civilian casualties to the total population of Gaza is comparable to that of Chechnya and less than in Vietnam, North Korea or the East Front of WW2. Unfortunately, civilian casualties are an inevitable part of modern war.

          • FlowVoid@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            2
            arrow-down
            5
            ·
            edit-2
            7 months ago

            I mean, there isn’t any obligation in war to make sure casualties are evenly distributed among both sides.

            Normally, a lopsided war ends only when the losing side surrenders.

        • can@sh.itjust.works
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          9
          ·
          7 months ago

          When it’s targeted at a specific group of people and there’s such a dramatic power imbalance, yes. Whether modern definitions agree or not.

          • FlowVoid@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            arrow-down
            5
            ·
            edit-2
            7 months ago

            All wars are targeted at a specific group of people.

            So if your definition amounts to a highly favorable balance of power, then all countries at war would aspire to make it a “genocide”.

            • can@sh.itjust.works
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              1
              ·
              edit-2
              7 months ago

              All wars are targeted at a specific group of people.

              Yes, my wording was vague. But say you went to war with Canada, a diverse nation. It would feel different if you broadly targeted all Canadians rather than specifically indigenous Canadians, or black Canadians, for example.

              And putting this on the table now: I am Canadian and I recognise my country was built upon its own genocide.

              Edit: Someone else feel free to chime in, I still don’t feel I am conveying this well

              • FlowVoid@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                1
                arrow-down
                1
                ·
                7 months ago

                Ok, then why would a hypothetical US invasion of Canada (which today, unlike in 1812, would be imbalanced in favor of the US) be better than an Israeli invasion of Gaza?

                • can@sh.itjust.works
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  1
                  ·
                  7 months ago

                  It wouldn’t be better but the circumstances would determine whether my mind would immediately jump to calling it that. I’m not necessarily quick to jump to claiming genocide but I won’t readily denounce it.

                  • FlowVoid@lemmy.world
                    link
                    fedilink
                    English
                    arrow-up
                    1
                    arrow-down
                    1
                    ·
                    7 months ago

                    Fair enough, but if an invasion of Canada is not necessarily genocide then there must be more to it than attacking a less powerful neighbor.